Like many I was horrified at the images of innocent people being brutally attacked and murdered by Hamas. Also on personal level somewhat scary as I was in Israel exactly 5 years to the date of the attack so had I gone to Israel on exact same dates only five years later, I would be stuck there. But that is besides point and point is more over 1,000 innocent Israelis have been brutally killed as well as some foreigners and even a few Canadians. Below is my thoughts on issue.
I can say I unequivocally support Israel here. This was an unprovoked attack by a terrorist group. I don’t often agree with Trudeau, but he was bang on when he said they are not the resistance, not freedom fighters, they are terrorists. As such I support Israel taking full action to eradicate Hamas. Obviously they should do what they can to avoid civilian casualties, however with how brutal Hamas is and fact they use human shields, sadly some innocent Palestinians will die. Let there be no mistake here though, Hamas and only Hamas is solely at fault for the bloodshed and deaths here. Gaza Strip is not occupied by Israel and has not been since 2005. As for claiming open air prison, I would remind people that Israel allows some to work in Israel and provides electricity while Egypt who is a neighboring Arab country frequently closes border and makes it very difficult for residents to leave. The blockade exists to keep Hamas from acquiring weapons. And some sympathetic governments are more than happy to help them. Hamas is also a dictatorship as they have not had an election since 2006 and rather than spending money to help their own people, they use it to attack Israel. I don’t know what role Iran played here, but if they are found to have played any role, there needs to be severe consequences including a complete economic embargo for any country that trades with Iran and sells them anything beyond humanitarian aid will face an embargo too. Likewise when this is over, there will need to be a thorough investigation in Israel as this was a huge security lapse that normally they are able to avoid. I support occupying Gaza until Hamas is removed from power and only once they have a government that recognizes Israel’s right to exist and ceases terrorism will Israel leave.
In terms of what this will mean, I think it is fair to say chances of a two state solution have gone from low to virtually non-existence and that is unfortunate. Its not just Israelis harmed by Hamas but Palestinians too. I don’t want to give up on never having some agreement but I think it is going to be very hard to do. Some have suggested Israel take all of Palestine but in exchange offer Palestinians full Israeli citizenship like they do for Israeli Arabs with all the rights Israeli citizens have. I can see some appeal in this, but would also make Jews a minority again after the history of persecution they have faced, they rightly want to ensure they at least have one country where they are the majority. Another is give West Bank to Jordan and Gaza Strip to Egypt which is what country they were part of from 1948 and 1967. Israel did that with Sinai Peninsula in 1979 so not without precedence but I get feeling neither Egypt or Jordan wants them. It seems many Arab countries happy to use Palestinians for political cause but aren’t willing to help them when in time of need. Egypt is planning to close Gaza border so, so much for helping fellow Arabs. At moment makes sense to have a unity government, but wouldn’t be surprised if this is end of Bibi. Israelis don’t take too kindly to security lapses. There is also idea of Palestinian state, but I think idea of that is unlikely anytime soon. Never mind an independent Palestine has not existed at any point in past 500 years. From 1300s to 1918, Israel & Palestinian territory was part of the Ottoman Empire. From 1918 to 1948, Palestine existed, but it was a British mandate not an independent country. From 1948 to 1967, Gaza was part of Egypt, West Bank part of Jordan, and Golan Heights part of Syria. To make things more difficult, Jerusalem is not a city you can easily split. I have been there and having an international border cut through middle of city I just don’t see as practical. Perhaps if not in such bad shape making it an international city open to all three major Abrahamic faiths would be logical solution, but that seems unlikely now.
In terms of Canadian government response, I support response of both Liberals & Conservatives and glad they have offered full support to Israel. I am disappointed with some anti-Semitism in NDP and while criticism of Israel is fine, some goes into denying the right for Israel to exist and such should not be tolerated in party. In terms of helping Canadians, we should if safe send a flight. In mean time embassy should be open 24/7 to help Canadians stuck in Israel. I believe El Al still flying out of Ben Guiron airport so may mean taking one of their flights as they have anti-missile defense systems which other airlines lack due to high costs. How we deal with this long term will depend on how events unfold, but I am glad to see Canada is supportive of Israel. We promised after the Holocaust never again and we need to stay true to that.
In terms of activists supporting Hamas, my thoughts are disgusts. I support the right to protest but one should note Hamas is designated as a terrorist organization in Canada and likewise we have hate laws so as long as don’t violate those, right to protests, but also consequences too in terms of those who disagree not wanting to associate with such. I get some are just supportive of Palestine and that is fair, but when a country has just been attacked it is a very insensitive time to hold such rallies. You didn’t see rallies criticizing US foreign policy days after 9/11. When a country is attacked, we should all mourn and be supportive. There is a time and place for those but now is not the time. However those supporting Hamas as well as chants from the River to the sea I totally condemn. This is not about a two state solution; this is calling for the elimination of Israel which is what Hamas wants and sadly far too many on left nowadays support. Likewise I have long noticed Anti-Semitism running rampant in academia back to my university days some 20 years ago and this is has just re-affirmed that. Student union dues need to be made optional as it is unfair to Jewish students to have to give money to those who call for the only Jewish state to be eliminated. Likewise disgusted with position of CUPE. I don’t support right to work laws as bad for workers, but Jews and those offended by their position do have legal right to donate to a charity equivalent amount of their union dues and should do so until the current leadership is removed. It is more galling head of CUPE in Ontario, Fred Hahn is openly gay pushing this as he would be imprisoned or killed under Hamas while Israel for all its imperfections has by far the best LGBT record in Middle East.
Some are calling Israel colonizers which is completely false. Jews originate from modern territory of Israel so unlike whites in Canada who were colonizers and settlers (I am talking about original colonizers, not all whites currently living in Canada), Jews are simply returning to their homeland. To be fair Palestinians are also indigenous to Israel. Even genetic studies have shown Jews and Palestinians are quite closely related. Also those calling it Apartheid state are totally wrong. Israel grants Arabs full citizenship and all the rights that come with it including right to vote and serve in government. In fact all road signs when I was in Israel were in Hebrew, Arabic, and English. By contrast many neighbors won’t even allow Israeli citizens to visit. That doesn’t mean Israel is perfect and yes they have done many things in Palestinian territories I disagree with. I likewise oppose settlements in Palestinian territory and I am not a fan of Bibi or his right wing government. But that doesn’t mean despite some criticisms of Israel I am against it. I fully support Israel’s right to exist as a Jewish state that respects rights of minorities. I would like a peace deal with Palestinians too, but both sides have to show willingness and Hamas is not interested. A peace deal is not possible when one side calls for Israel to be wiped off the map. Note while this very critical of Hamas, my objection and anger is at Hamas not the Palestinian people who are victims too.
afiscalconservativepointofview 
Miles, I think you offer valuable historical context on the tragedy unfolding in Israel and Gaza right now, and I really appreciate that. I can support many points that you make as a result — but, I think I hold the whole international community accountable to some extent for where Israel and its neighbours are today. I personally believe like you that more than one thing can be true. One can support that Israel has the right to exist and also criticize the way the government of so many recent years has continued to seize land from Palestinians and make deals with their own extreme religious communities to stay in power. Critiquing the actions and policies of a government and/or its leaders, whether that of Israel – or Iran – or elsewhere, does not automatically equate with being anti-Semitic, anti-Islamic, or anti-any other religious or ethnic group. If the majority of Israelis actually supported the path that Netanyahu has charted for the past several years, I doubt we would have seen the broad sustained protests that everyday citizens held over these past months. And I don’t see how anyone can expect multiple generations of people to live in refugee camps or otherwise intolerable circumstances for decades, without some kind of criminal organization like Hamas finding fertile ground from which to wreak the kind of brutal havoc they are now producing for both Gaza and Israel. It seems like an impossible situation for everyone in the region, and one that is unlikely to change – unless not just the majority of Israelis and Palestinians demand that their governing bodies re-engage in meaningful steps to a different relationship – but that other countries also more concretely contribute to supporting feasible solutions to not only Israel’s security, but the right of Palestinians to a future that includes hope. The NYT essay today that I added below is from Gaza father. I think it holds some useful insights for anyone who really wants peace, no matter where they live…..
NEW YORK TIMES GUEST ESSAY
What More Must the Children of Gaza Suffer?
Oct. 12, 2023, 5:03 a.m. ET
By Fadi Abu Shammalah
Mr. Abu Shammalah, Just Vision’s outreach associate in Gaza and the executive director of the General Union of Cultural Centers in Gaza, wrote from the Khan Yunis refugee camp in Gaza.
The bomb exploded a few hundred feet from where I was sitting with my wife, Safa, and my three children, Ali, Karam and Adam. Ali, 13, screamed; Karam, 10, buried his face in my chest; and Adam, 5, burst into tears.
We were in the outdoor area at the Rafah crossing between the Gaza Strip and Egypt on Tuesday morning. I had been lucky enough to obtain permits for my wife and kids to cross into Egypt so they could wait out the terrifying violence raining down on Gaza in safety. But before their names were called, Israel bombed the crossing, at that point the only way in or out of the strip.
We quickly ushered the kids into the crossing’s hall, but a policeman started shouting for everyone to evacuate immediately; the crossing was being closed.
Thronged by dozens of others, we jumped in my car and sped back to my family home in the Khan Yunis refugee camp, where Ali and Adam continued to cry while Karam sat silently shaking.
We were just one family, experiencing one terrifying close call. More than two million Palestinians are trapped inside Gaza, about half under the age of 18, as Israel pounds us in retaliation for Hamas’s surprise attack on Saturday, with the United States promising “surging” military support.
Apartment complexes in Gaza City have been leveled, houses bombed and families annihilated. I can’t even recognize the upscale Rimal neighborhood of Gaza City — it’s been so thoroughly damaged. At least 326 children in the Gaza Strip have been killed since Saturday, according to the Ministry of Health here. Women and children from my extended family were killed in an attack on Tuesday, and my cousin was killed on Wednesday. The smell of explosives permeates the entire strip. Yoav Gallant, Israel’s minister of defense, called us “human animals” and announced that the suffocating siege that Palestinians in Gaza have endured for more than 15 years would be tightened even further: The strip is now cut off from food, electricity and fuel.
No electricity means no internet or connection to the outside world. Raw sewage is seeping into Gaza’s streets; waste treatment facilities require electricity. The water supply has been cut. Driving south on Monday, I passed five United Nations schools-turned-shelters, so jampacked with displaced people that families spilled out into the yards. Dread grows inside me, as I know the worst is yet to come.
Over 2,300 Israelis and Palestinians have been killed so far, the majority of them civilians. I am saddened by the killing of all civilians. I know that the pain of an Israeli parent is no different from the anguish of a mother or father in Gaza. Yet I’m not surprised that we have found ourselves at this bloody point of no return.
Many of the fighters who breached those walls are probably just a few years older than Ali; many of them were born during the second intifada. Their entire experience has been Israeli military occupation, siege and devastating military assault upon assault in an enclave of 140 square miles, with unemployment and poverty rates of approximately 50 percent. This is the history, and these are the conditions that have shaped so many in Gaza, not a justification. Israel helped create these fighters by starving them of hope, dignity and a future.
I am trying to imagine some positive outcome that this terrifying escalation might bring. Perhaps there will be an exchange of prisoners. Though Palestinians have the right to resist occupation, I have always preferred unarmed, civilian-led, direct mass action. Maybe the Palestinian, Israeli and international activists who have been using these tactics to oppose Israel’s occupation and a system that major human rights organizations consider apartheid — including Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch and the Israeli rights group B’Tselem —will be able to harness this horror to someday advance their vision of a future of liberation and a decent life for all.
But at the moment, with Israeli troops massing on the border with Gaza, suggesting an imminent ground invasion, I can’t think beyond the coming days.
How many more families will be obliterated? How many children will be made orphans and homeless? What will happen when the shelves in our markets are empty and reserves of fuel for our hospitals’ generators run out? What will become of our collective humanity if Israeli civilians continue to be targeted and bombs keep shattering our infrastructure, leaving Gazan children lying dead in our streets?
Unless the international community intervenes, Israel can continue to cut off access to water, food, fuel, electricity, medications and every other necessity of life. Without outside pressure, particularly from the United States, Israel can continue to flatten our cities and refugee camps.
As Israel maintains its rampage, I keep asking myself, “What’s in store for Ali, Karam and Adam?” We are unable to shield them from the pervasive violence and trauma. An explosion on Monday rattled the windows, prompting Adam to implore, “If the Israelis must bomb us, can’t they at least use smaller, quieter bombs?” Ali is a talented young musician, with an artist’s temperament and a musician’s soul. Does Israel want to convert him from an artist to a fighter? If my children have no hope for their future, I cannot guarantee what path they take.
The international community must immediately do everything in its power to ensure that my children — that all children in the region — are able to live in freedom, with dignity and safety. That is the only solution to the current horror show.
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Israel has done many things I disagree with but that does not change fact a terrorist organization, Hamas attacked unprovoked and killed many innocent civilians. Also Israel while imperfect still on human rights does better than almost all other countries in that part of the world. One can criticize Israel and Israeli government without being Anti-Semitic. But calling for eradication of state of Israel or Jews to be kicked out of Israel is anti-Semitic and far too many are calling for that. Asking for a two state solution totally reasonable and even desirable. Asking for Jews to be kicked out of Israel is not.
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I agree, but I also cannot support starving 2 million Palestinians of food, water, electricity and fuel while also giving them no safe passage away from war. I had to share this essay in today’s NYT by an Israeli soldier – it says so much truth I think…
NYT GUEST ESSAY
I’m Going to War for Israel. Palestinians Are Not My Enemy.
Oct. 13, 2023
By Nir Avishai Cohen
Mr. Cohen, a major in the reserves of the Israel Defense Forces, is the author of the book “Love Israel, Support Palestine.”
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I was in Austin, Texas, for work on Saturday when I received a call from my commander in the Israel Defense Forces to return to Israel and head to the front line. I didn’t hesitate. I knew that the citizens of my country were in real danger. My duty first and foremost is to join the fight against those who unleashed a massacre on my people. I boarded the first flight I found out of Austin to head home to join the I.D.F. reserves, where I serve as a brigade operations command officer.
During my long flight to Israel, my mind couldn’t rest. I was trying to write down my feelings and thoughts about everything happening — and everything that’s about to happen — in my beloved country.
Little by little, the dimensions of the horrors of the most brutal attack that Israelis have experienced since the establishment of the state were being revealed. Hundreds of Hamas terrorists slaughtered more than 1,200 people, including women, children and older people. About 150 citizens and soldiers have been taken captive. There’s nothing in the world that can justify the murder of hundreds of innocent people.
But I’d like to say one thing clearly, before I go to battle: There’s no such thing as “unavoidable.” This war could have been avoided, and no one did enough to prevent it. Israel did not do enough to make peace; we just conquered the Palestinian territories in the West Bank, expanded the illegal settlements and imposed a long-term siege on the Gaza Strip.
For 56 years Israel has been subjecting Palestinians to oppressive military rule. In my book “Love Israel, Support Palestine,” I wrote: “Israeli society has to ask itself very important questions about where and why the blood of its sons and daughters was spilled. A Messianic religious minority has dragged us into a muddy swamp, and we are following them as if it were the Piper from Hamelin.” When I wrote these words last year, I didn’t realize how deep in the mud we were, and how much more blood could be shed in so little time.
I am now going to defend my country against enemies who want to kill my people. Our enemies are the deadly terrorist organizations that are being controlled by Islamic extremists.
Palestinians aren’t the enemy. The millions of Palestinians who live right here next to us, between the Mediterranean Sea and Jordan, are not our enemy. Just like the majority of Israelis want to live a calm, peaceful and dignified life, so do Palestinians. Israelis and Palestinians alike have been in the grip of a religious minority for decades. On both sides, the intractable positions of a small group have dragged us into violence. It doesn’t matter who is more cruel, or more ruthless. The ideology of both have fueled this conflict, leading to the death of too many innocent civilians.
As a major in the reserves, it is important to me to make it clear that in this already unstoppable new war, we cannot allow the massacre of innocent Israelis to result in the massacre of innocent Palestinians. Israel must remember that there are more than two million people living in the Gaza Strip. The vast majority of them are innocent. Israel must do everything in its power to avoid killing innocent people, and focus on destroying the militant army of Hamas.
This war, like others before it, will end sooner or later. I am not sure I will come back from it alive, but I do know that a minute after the war is over, both Israelis and Palestinians will have to reckon with the leaders who led them to this moment. We must wake up and not let the extremists rule. Palestinians and Israelis must denounce the extremists who are driven by religious fanaticism. The Israelis will have to oust National Security Minister Itamar Ben-Gvir, Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich and their far-right circle from power, and the Palestinians will have to oust the leadership of Hamas.
I try to look for shreds of hope. The Yom Kippur War, the most difficult war that Israel had known until this week, started by surprise in 1973. After a peace agreement between Israel and Egypt was finally signed in 1979, the border with Egypt — one that was once the site of the dead and wounded — became a border of peace.
Israelis must realize that there is no greater security asset than peace. The strongest army cannot protect the country the way peace does. This current war proves it once again. Israel has followed the path of war for too long.
At the end, after all of the dead Israelis and Palestinians are buried, after we have finished washing away the rivers of blood, the people who share a home in this land will have to understand that there is no other choice but to follow the path of peace. That is where true victory lies.
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